Model Railway Forum

Thank-you Ian.
In context of "Swapping the 2 power wires for the decoder should be easy, " I was imagining a loco with no dcc decoder, no socket, old style, but assume from your reply old 4 pin decoder (sockets) are replaced for later versions with more pins.

"Don't limit yourself to one manufacturer. "
You are right. I have to-date on basis as same make equates to fewer problems.
Now I seem to be confined by availability of 1 m/f when looking at DCC options, also, I seem to have opted for GWR Region, so need to cast net wider for variety of rolling stock.

>0-6-0 Pannier tank locos generally don't have space for speakers even if a decoder can be fitted.
Well those big panniers on the side need to store something.
I've seen videos of them with sound, but since seen that it was sometimes a post-production item or O guage - need to look some more I thought I'd seen them.
I suspected there isn't space, as I've seen photos with big locos having to use tender for "extras".
This is where I believe m/f need to re-visit to accommodate speakers into the design and enthuse the buyer rather than expect each user to have technical skills to retro fit.
At present, it would seem the advantages of DCC cannot be fully used due to not having a cavity at design stage.

WTD.. a light at the end of the proverbial tunnel.

Dave, almost without exception, all manufacturers have designed their locos to accept DCC for maybe the last ten years. Some now even have speakers prefitted allowing the user to fit a decoder of their own choice. You will be hard pressed to buy a current loco that is not at least DCC ready.
For example Hornby design philosophy is to provide a socket and space in the tender for a speaker.

Small tank locos will always be tight on space but usually a gap can be found to fit a sugarcube speaker which are available in many different sizes. Owners have to supply their own ingenuity to fit the bits in but start by looking for space in the smokebox, side tanks and coal bunker.

Older locos will have been designed long before DCC was an option and as such surgery would almost certainly be required to retrofit. Remember also that older motors can require more current to work and that can overload the decoders.
Before fitting DCC to any loco it must run faultlessly on DC and for older motors conduct a stall test to measure current draw before selecting a suitable decoder.

"Owners have to supply their own ingenuity to fit the bits in but start by looking for space in the smokebox, side tanks and coal bunker."
Not shooting the messenger, but it shouldn't be that way. When m/f's say DCC ready, they should be altering the design to have suitable space pockets and consider different motor design or hole in chassis. They shouldn't be expecting customers to compensate for their lack of forsesight. They need economy of scale, so making newcomers jump through hoops will deter.
Your tips on possible cavities are appreciated.

>test to measure current draw
Had to google how to do that. Understood.
https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index ... nsumption/

Is it fair to say relacement motors are usually an option for "old" items? I get the impression they (hornby atleast) have been using the same motors for decades.

>Before fitting DCC to any loco it must run faultlessly on DC
Yesterday I saw "Jenny" on youtube fit (digitrax I think) a battery unit PCB that works for couple of seconds without power, to give more consistant power delivery on very loco - 040 in the example.
Dave

Just buy what you need Dcc Fitted and save your brain for building your layout.

works for me, being a bear of limited brain.

Dave S wrote: ↑Sat Jan 22, 2022 11:25 am "Owners have to supply their own ingenuity to fit the bits in but start by looking for space in the smokebox, side tanks and coal bunker."
Not shooting the messenger, but it shouldn't be that way. When m/f's say DCC ready, they should be altering the design to have suitable space pockets and consider different motor design or hole in chassis. They shouldn't be expecting customers to compensate for their lack of forsesight. They need economy of scale, so making newcomers jump through hoops will deter.
Your tips on possible cavities are appreciated.

>test to measure current draw
Had to google how to do that. Understood.
https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index ... nsumption/

Is it fair to say relacement motors are usually an option for "old" items? I get the impression they (hornby atleast) have been using the same motors for decades.

>Before fitting DCC to any loco it must run faultlessly on DC
Yesterday I saw "Jenny" on youtube fit (digitrax I think) a battery unit PCB that works for couple of seconds without power, to give more consistant power delivery on very loco - 040 in the example.
Dave

You're correct re space available. What manufacturers should be doing IMO is making a simple to fit DCC decoder that slots in to a compartment that avoids having to remove the locos body. Much like a cell phones SIM card fits into a phone. But that's light years away, if ever!

That concept is not so far away Brian. I think it’s Dapol that have designed their new Prarie with a PCB for speaker and decoder that slides out of the smokebox door. Sure I’ve seen a recent diesel with a panel under the floor for the decoder.
The wider use of similar methods is probably constrained by the rate at which models are redesigned.

That is correct Steve. Comes with a small tool to remove said PCB from the smokebox.

I did post the details back in Feb 21 in the Dapol section.