Liveries by date

[Midland Pullman]

Like most modellers over the years I've bought too many loco's and rolling stock. I've found that running items the wrong livery or even items that clash in age is just not quite right. By running stock in an era it sort of solves the problem. I know its my railway and I can do what I like but in this case I don't like.. So I've obtained a spreadsheet by Noel Leaver ordering the dates new liveries came in. Finally to my question - lets say a new livery came in on the 1st January one year how long did it take for the old paint scheme to be complete fleet wide for example how long did it take before the LNER teak coaches were painted or how long did it take to paint out the HST colours before they all became Virgin. I appreciate different types of vehicle at different times would have lasted in old livery compared to much later types and years. In a nut shell what overlaps are members aware of? I'm particularly interested in British Railways 1948 to 1984 but I do run some more modern stuff as well.
Roger

[Walkingthedog]

There were still some private owner wagons running in the late 50's. Locos were usually repainted during an overhaul.

[vespa]

I too habe done the same buying what I fancied and veering away from BR 1948-68. In theory I could easily change eras before or after. I am now getting BRITISH RAILWAYS on locos to give that switch over period. Regarding new rail stock or whoever today's owner is, I have given up on that.

[Mike Parkes]

Modern liveries are often quite heavilly vinyl applications and its relatively easy to debrand stock although it can look tatty, There are examples of steam locos etc lasting many years in old liveries.

[vespa]

Yes we also had stupid names hitting the scene when the record player man took over the WCML with trains (engines end) named after daft BBC dress shows. Where are the electric locos with the brave drivers names eg "Wallace G Oakes GC" I am fully aware that vinyl wraps are used and that is just as well, as the repaints would cost £Ks. Look how quick the Shropshire and Wrexham or vice versa lasted. Don't forget if you use the railways then indirectly the user is paying for these wraps.

[sandy]

I have collected over the years like many others, a wide selection of different companies and liveries from Victorian times to the end of steam.
( only have 4 Diesels) I like to have running days of diferent times. Not always easy. The engine yard for instance has a coaling tower for BR days then put that back in cupboard and replace it with coaling staiths. I leave lots of things like that not fixed to Baseboard so I can swap things about for different piriods. You can't get everything right but it pleases me.

[Simon_100]

Such an interestic post on a topic that's been excercising my mind - or what's left of it - for some time.

I agree with others here, and on Wikipedia, etc. that new liveries schemes were implemented when rolling stock went in for service, presumably locos every year or so depending on their use, carriages every two or three years, wagons up to five years, etc. - although somewhere I've seen seven years mentioned so I'm sure a bit of research into the practices of various workshops in histories, say of Crewe, Swindon, etc. might be a good source in info.

I think that for practical modelling it really dpends where you set the bar for yourself - unless you're exhibiting I suppose - there will be those who are happy with a 9F to be towing a GWR liveried autocoach alonside a sea of blue modern image trains - does anyone remember the 'Modern Image' debate raging on the letters page on the RM back in the early 'seventies? That nearly put me off the hobby for life! - and at the other end of the spectrum the 'Fine scale' brigade who won't tolerate any deviation from prototype and who, IMHO of course, are rather missing the point of a 'creative' hobby.

Like you I have amassed an embarrasing number of locos compared to the ambitions of my tiny - and as yet still unbuilt! - model railway - and of course the trains for them to haul. Like many folks I suppose I tend to seek engines that I particularly like - luckily my taste if for small tender englines, especially Moguls so you wont see any A4's thundering into my humble branch line terminus! - and in a livery version that I think suits them best. So for example I have sought and found a 14XX in 'late' lined Brunswick green livery so to me it's only right that it should be coupled to a marroon autocoach*. Others, e.g. the Ivatt Mogul, are in early lined BR black and by setting a date for the model - in my case September 1957 which is rather cute as that's when I was born - that allows these variants to run reasonable comfortably together ...

Another personal bar is the supposed location and details of the model itself. I also happen to love the Drummnd LSWR designs and have recently found (as bargains at Hattons of course) an M7 and 0-6-0 goods engines, so a few Southern region carriages and wagons are in the wishlist. But I've already bought GWR based building kits and will fit GWR signals when I get to that stage. So how to reconcile that notoriously difficult customer, namely 'self'? Well although I'm a dab hand at spotting the provenance of locomotives¡s and set my standard that their trains have to be plausible I couldn't differentiate between a GWR or SW/LSWR signal if one fell on my head, nor the buildings really, and in any event I can always run a 'joint' line, even inventing a history to explain that when in reality company rivalries would make it unlikely - once again the 'fifties' are a source of plausible explanations - excuses? - namely that even long before Beeching hundreds of stations were closed where they duplicated services to villages, towns and even cities ...

Regs

Simom

* in fact I bought the autocoah first as it was a bargain, at the time notbreally knowing much about the subletie so BR liveries, so then I waited and waited and waited for the green 14XX to turn up at Hattons, literally putting the cart before the horse!

[vespa]

One of the daftest things I did and sometimes still do, is to buy a rake of coaches or a set of wagons for a specific engine. I have just bought a Dapol Prairie in BR Black and started looking for 3 ex GW coaches to suit. I also thought about goods wagons and Oxord do the best value for money these days at around £10 each. How do Hornby and Bachmann charge £20 plus for a coal wagon. I suppose they are private owner ones with "Mugg and Co" printed on the side.

[Simon_100]

One of the daftest things I did and sometimes still do, is to buy a rake of coaches or a set of wagons for a specific engine. I have just bought a Dapol Prairie in BR Black and started looking for 3 ex GW coaches to suit. I also thought about goods wagons and Oxord do the best value for money these days at around £10 each. How do Hornby and Bachmann charge £20 plus for a coal wagon. I suppose they are private owner ones with "Mugg and Co" printed on the side.

You're dead right there, one train per engine would inded be silly. I think the knack is not to be too specific and aim to mix-n-match. Apart from the autocoach, which could also be hauled by my late crest 57XX to make a change, I have two rakes of coaches, a 'B' set in BR Crimson and three Collett corridor coaches in Blood 'n' Custard, so both early liveries that could equally go with late livery Western Region locos - if I had any (see below) so my wish list of for a rake of green Southern Region coaches for the M7 or Class N2 mogul, which is in early lined black livery and looks very smart in it too. So not counting the autocoach, which is a bit of a special case, I aim to have just the three rakes of coaches shared between six passenger or mixed traffic locos wth at least three more late livery engines that I hope to add to the collection including two 'green' engines namely a Dukedog and an ex-GWR Mogul in Brunswick green (I've already got one of these in early black), then for the Southern Region stock a Drummond Class T9 4-4-0 in whichever version crops up. Then there are also the two goods locos, the Drummond already mentioned and a Dean goods in early BR black - including the boiler dome, I'm very pleased with this as I've yet to see a brass domed model done well in model form. In this was an operating session is made more interesting, especially as there's a randon element to allocating engines to trains as locos work their way up the queue after having been turned at the far end of the fiddle yard

[darkscot]

I have always wondered about trains made up of private owner wagons. Would you get a train of wagons exclusively from one company, or mainly one company or a total random mix? What was the most usual?