Received this exceptionally nice colliery collection from Sandy, but I confess I have not a clue how coal is moved from pit head to wagon in Britain. In the USA, it is done by chutes, of which none are evident herein. Suggestions? Advice?
Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Received this exceptionally nice colliery collection from Sandy, but I confess I have not a clue how coal is moved from pit head to wagon in Britain. In the USA, it is done by chutes, of which none are evident herein. Suggestions? Advice?
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Her's a short video of a small colliery in the Midlands.
The coal is taken from the "Cage" which brings the coal from underground in "Tubs" It is then taken to the "Screens" where it is graded and then loaded into motor trucks as shown or railway wagons by chutes.
My grandfather was the engineer at this colliery and my Uncle drove the winding engine.!
Hope this is useful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jip1cRLaFQc
Coloin.
The coal is taken from the "Cage" which brings the coal from underground in "Tubs" It is then taken to the "Screens" where it is graded and then loaded into motor trucks as shown or railway wagons by chutes.
My grandfather was the engineer at this colliery and my Uncle drove the winding engine.!
Hope this is useful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jip1cRLaFQc
Coloin.
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Thank you very much, and yes, that was short! Blink and you miss it!
Several things jumped out at me, the first was a lorry being loaded with coal. Thus it must have been slated for a local delivery, as anything else moved more than in the immediate locality would certainly go by rail. So there is a chute. The other thing that jumped out was this one rather cheery fellow wrestling mineral wagons looking as though he was dressed in his Sunday best, to include a carefully knotted bow tie. One surmises, perhaps, that they knew in advance that a moving picture crew would be on hand and they wanted to look their best for posterity.
I remain curious as to the overall landscape of such a place. In the USA, such mines typically had the look of being utterly ramshackle, as then, as now, mine operators did not want to spend a penny more than required for the physical plant. Most such buildings were of unpainted, weather worn, wood, whilst what I've seen thus far of the UK scene is orderly, if not Dickinsonianly stern, brick. In the USA, the street areas would be mud, or at best slag laid over the mud to prevent vehicles from getting sunk up to their axles. I am wondering (I have yet to do a web search of British colliers) if British colliers would have the streets in cobble stone, which would be commensurate with the sturdy brick structures.
Moreover, it is possible that a British mine might have been digging out coal for several, or many, centuries in the same spot. Conversely, American mineral deposits are relatively recent (within the last century) and the trend was to exhaust one vein and travel down the road to the next, with little attention to any sort of permanence.
Lastly, these fellows all looked particularly rugged and of good cheer. All muscle and bone; tough as nails. Quite a heritage you from which you hale.
I wonder if Reverend Farnworth might weigh in. His histories of rail both English and international are remarkable in detail. I read them with great interest, not only for their superb content, but exceptional expository style.
Several things jumped out at me, the first was a lorry being loaded with coal. Thus it must have been slated for a local delivery, as anything else moved more than in the immediate locality would certainly go by rail. So there is a chute. The other thing that jumped out was this one rather cheery fellow wrestling mineral wagons looking as though he was dressed in his Sunday best, to include a carefully knotted bow tie. One surmises, perhaps, that they knew in advance that a moving picture crew would be on hand and they wanted to look their best for posterity.
I remain curious as to the overall landscape of such a place. In the USA, such mines typically had the look of being utterly ramshackle, as then, as now, mine operators did not want to spend a penny more than required for the physical plant. Most such buildings were of unpainted, weather worn, wood, whilst what I've seen thus far of the UK scene is orderly, if not Dickinsonianly stern, brick. In the USA, the street areas would be mud, or at best slag laid over the mud to prevent vehicles from getting sunk up to their axles. I am wondering (I have yet to do a web search of British colliers) if British colliers would have the streets in cobble stone, which would be commensurate with the sturdy brick structures.
Moreover, it is possible that a British mine might have been digging out coal for several, or many, centuries in the same spot. Conversely, American mineral deposits are relatively recent (within the last century) and the trend was to exhaust one vein and travel down the road to the next, with little attention to any sort of permanence.
Lastly, these fellows all looked particularly rugged and of good cheer. All muscle and bone; tough as nails. Quite a heritage you from which you hale.
I wonder if Reverend Farnworth might weigh in. His histories of rail both English and international are remarkable in detail. I read them with great interest, not only for their superb content, but exceptional expository style.
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
British
American
The British collier appears to be much tidier. Of the street, no conclusion can be drawn. What would the surface be constructed of? Certainly not the profusion of mud.
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
It could be chutes here as well in GB. In my local mines the drams ( small mine waggons which worked from underground to lift to surface.) wheeled out of the lift onto narrow gauge tracks and went to chutes and carried on conveyor belts to loading tower with standard gauge railway siding under. Hope that is not as crear as mud. Search for pictures on line as all mines were different depending on how much space they had to work in. Some mines had Truck loading bays and or Rail sidings. My locoal open cast mine had both. The trucks were also taking loads for export to european countries not only for local deliveries. Britain is a small island not like USA. The name Dram was used in wales for the small underground trucks in England, Scotland and N Island they had other names for them.
I am sure there are some on here who can give more information on here. There normally are. Ask WTD He seems to have good knowledge about loads of things.
[url=https://postimg.cc/WFBpmcDq]
[/u click on link
I found this showing diferent ways of taking coal from sharft to to transport. Some winding engines could have been Eletrical power or steam in earlier times times.
I am sure there are some on here who can give more information on here. There normally are. Ask WTD He seems to have good knowledge about loads of things.
[url=https://postimg.cc/WFBpmcDq]
[/u click on linkI found this showing diferent ways of taking coal from sharft to to transport. Some winding engines could have been Eletrical power or steam in earlier times times.
Last edited by sandy on Wed Aug 17, 2022 2:09 pm, edited 10 times in total.
Sandy
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Thank you, Sandy, I shall. I am leaning towards a cobble stoned street, in and around the site, would that be entirely off?
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
In the 20th century most mines would have had concrete hard surface roads and yards ect: in the old days it may well have been other surfaces like cobbles broken or crushed stone ect: I am not sure. Depends on the mine I suppose.. My guess would be if it looks right it is right.
The building you have are 20th century 1950s era.
From memory I think there is a picture of mine layout on the Bachmann building boxes. I may not be right on that. The engine house (the one with steps at front). The steps and windows would face the winding gear. The cables would go through the holes in the front windows. The other buildings will go more or less anywhere they look right.
The building you have are 20th century 1950s era.
From memory I think there is a picture of mine layout on the Bachmann building boxes. I may not be right on that. The engine house (the one with steps at front). The steps and windows would face the winding gear. The cables would go through the holes in the front windows. The other buildings will go more or less anywhere they look right.
Sandy
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Interesting answers from Sandy there, Chops.
Just to add my 2centsworth.
Memories of pits around Glasshoughton Yorkshire, Easington Colliery County Durham and Washington County Tyne & Wear (formerly County Durham).
1930s/40s The area around John H. Rhodes Prince of Wales pits, Glasshoughton was hard compacted slag. Compacted so hard so whenever it rained the water remained on top with nowhere to run. I suppose when dry it could resemble concrete. Cobbles were evident where the railways ran into the pit yards. They were not clean by any standards. What with coal dust getting into every crevice rainfall was on a losing battle. Rainfall did clean the tops of cobbles, but afterwards tiny bits of dust would sparkle like dark blue diamonds. (Coal is not all black
)
The main streets where the mining families lived were hard compacted slag also. The more wealthy families had cobbled streets. The back lanes of houses were soil with ash (from the fires in the houses) covering the walking area
1960s Easington Colliery (Billy Elliot film was filmed here) The whole area was cobbled until the main road through Easington. This road is outside the coal mine area and is covered in tarmac. The street names are easy to remember. First Street. Second Street. Third Street, and so on.
1970s Washington. The pits had closed. Gone went the cobbles, the slag heaps and pit ponds. A new housing estate with the area named after the pits. Blackfell Pit area is Blackfell Village; Glebe Pit area is Glebe Village and so on.
As an aside. Rose Pit close to Rothwell Station (near Leeds Yorkshire) was sunk between 1847 and 1853 and was in production until 1925. After that the shaft was used for ventilation of the Fanny Pit workings. It is believed the buildings were demolished in 1947.
I have to smile at the rather cheery fellow wrestling mineral wagons looking as though he was dressed in his Sunday best, to include a carefully knotted bow tie.
It was common for men to wear some kind of short tie/ scarf; many a day with no shirt. Be they be at a mine or farmer's field.
As for American mineworking watch a film called 'Matewan'.
Hope all this helps.
Glencairn
I forgot. If you model a mine and its workings do not forget a small first aid building. I spent the night in the one at Easington Colliery, (but that is another story. )
Glencairn
Just to add my 2centsworth.
Memories of pits around Glasshoughton Yorkshire, Easington Colliery County Durham and Washington County Tyne & Wear (formerly County Durham).
1930s/40s The area around John H. Rhodes Prince of Wales pits, Glasshoughton was hard compacted slag. Compacted so hard so whenever it rained the water remained on top with nowhere to run. I suppose when dry it could resemble concrete. Cobbles were evident where the railways ran into the pit yards. They were not clean by any standards. What with coal dust getting into every crevice rainfall was on a losing battle. Rainfall did clean the tops of cobbles, but afterwards tiny bits of dust would sparkle like dark blue diamonds. (Coal is not all black
)The main streets where the mining families lived were hard compacted slag also. The more wealthy families had cobbled streets. The back lanes of houses were soil with ash (from the fires in the houses) covering the walking area
1960s Easington Colliery (Billy Elliot film was filmed here) The whole area was cobbled until the main road through Easington. This road is outside the coal mine area and is covered in tarmac. The street names are easy to remember. First Street. Second Street. Third Street, and so on.
1970s Washington. The pits had closed. Gone went the cobbles, the slag heaps and pit ponds. A new housing estate with the area named after the pits. Blackfell Pit area is Blackfell Village; Glebe Pit area is Glebe Village and so on.
As an aside. Rose Pit close to Rothwell Station (near Leeds Yorkshire) was sunk between 1847 and 1853 and was in production until 1925. After that the shaft was used for ventilation of the Fanny Pit workings. It is believed the buildings were demolished in 1947.
I have to smile at the rather cheery fellow wrestling mineral wagons looking as though he was dressed in his Sunday best, to include a carefully knotted bow tie.
It was common for men to wear some kind of short tie/ scarf; many a day with no shirt. Be they be at a mine or farmer's field.
As for American mineworking watch a film called 'Matewan'.
Hope all this helps.
Glencairn
I forgot. If you model a mine and its workings do not forget a small first aid building. I spent the night in the one at Easington Colliery, (but that is another story.
)Glencairn
To the world you are someone. To someone you are the world
I Cannot Afford the Luxury of a Negative Thought.
I Cannot Afford the Luxury of a Negative Thought.
Re: Advice please: How does one get coal from pit head to wagon?
Most useful and interesting insight, Glencairn. Thank you, this does indeed help me to visualize where to go with this project.
Tell me, does the UK still engage in coal mining, or other minerals, today? There is not a lot of room to go in the UK, compared to the US, by comparison, so my guess is the main direction was to go down, not laterally. Have all these mines been played out after hundreds and hundreds of years of mining?
Am I correct in my supposition that UK mining had a more permanent status, whereas USA mines tended to travel every ten years or less, once they finished with a vein? I do have some idea that a number of small mining enterprises have gone back in after "the scraps," to utilize veins of coal too small for the large operations. (They look like dreadful affairs, and the risks are no less now than then).
There is a lot of controversy regarding strip mining, where the top of a mountain is simply carted off to bare open the coal veins (and other mineral wealth). While the environmental impact is certainly concerning, so is the human impact of men dying in coal shafts. If we're going to use these minerals, men should not have to pay with their lives.
On a lighter note, as many of you know, George Stephenson, Sr., an unschooled genius, developed the "Geordie Lamp," which undoubtedly saved untold legions of miner's lives.
Tell me, does the UK still engage in coal mining, or other minerals, today? There is not a lot of room to go in the UK, compared to the US, by comparison, so my guess is the main direction was to go down, not laterally. Have all these mines been played out after hundreds and hundreds of years of mining?
Am I correct in my supposition that UK mining had a more permanent status, whereas USA mines tended to travel every ten years or less, once they finished with a vein? I do have some idea that a number of small mining enterprises have gone back in after "the scraps," to utilize veins of coal too small for the large operations. (They look like dreadful affairs, and the risks are no less now than then).
There is a lot of controversy regarding strip mining, where the top of a mountain is simply carted off to bare open the coal veins (and other mineral wealth). While the environmental impact is certainly concerning, so is the human impact of men dying in coal shafts. If we're going to use these minerals, men should not have to pay with their lives.
On a lighter note, as many of you know, George Stephenson, Sr., an unschooled genius, developed the "Geordie Lamp," which undoubtedly saved untold legions of miner's lives.
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